Some footage from a few weeks ago on our radio show, chatting about the State of the Union Address and Chris Matthews’ comments on it.
Raw Footage “I Forgot He Was Black”
Previous post: Raw Footage: Eternia on the Railroad
Next post: Lyricism and Capitalism
{ 26 comments… read them below or add one }
“Let’s see it & be sane about it”.
On point again, while the rest is just nilll.
If Matthews really forgot, Obama’s race would have disappeared and he would not have mentioned his amnesia. Matthews’ forgetfulness begs the question: What reminded him? (Probably not “negro dialect.”)
I share your belief that Matthews was trying to be complimentary. I suspect that he was very aware of Obama’s blackness during the State of the Union address. He was probably excited that there was a black man speaking. There is nothing wrong with noticing the first black president doing something presidential in a nation with a long history of racial strife.
“Blackness” is complex and informs individual black people in myriad ways. I am all for people noticing my blackness and I want people to be curious about my particular kind of blackness as they learn about me. I was the media to extend that same type of curiosity toward Obama’s blackness.
The other problem with Matthews’ statement is that he applied his simplistic and essentializing idea of blackness to Obama, and then was surprised that the idea doesn’t fit. Blackness isn’t something that needs to be forgotten, Matthews needs to let go of his archaic ideas!
One of the things we are all going to need on our collective journey toward “rationally racial” is greater sophistication in thoughts, words, and deeds. Thanks for elevating the discussion.
thanks, very well said
I thought about a few things when I heard Chris Matthews’ comment and you touched on one: that he really didn’t forget Obama is black, because if he had he wouldn’t have mentioned it at all. He didn’t wake up in the middle of the night after the address and go “Wait a minute, Obama’s black!” He thought it would be a clever thing to say in this “post-racial America” we supposedly live in, and it came out kind of twisted.
I was also reminded of instances from my own life where people have told me I don’t “sound black” (like that Chris Rock joke about Colin Powell “speaking so well”). It’s meant as a compliment but I don’t take it as one. Better to acknowledge my speech as part of me as a whole – take the way I speak as part of my whole package, at the forefront of which is my blackness. Same with Obama. Acknowledge that it’s becoming natural to see him, and acknowledge that that means YOU feel more natural about seeing him as president. He’s as black today as he was at birth; what “post-racial America” should mean, or what I’d like it to mean, is that we feel more comfortable discussing and acknowledging and celebrating race and culture rather than ignoring it altogether. That’s what Chris Matthews should have said.
Thanks for putting into words my very thoughts. I’ve always been suspicious of people that say that they don’t “see” race. I always feel like replying that I don’t “see” stupid either, but I know it’s there.
I feel as though Chris Matthews meant well…but you said it best J! Its not about just acting as thought “oh no…nobody has a different racial background….we forgot about that thing called “slavery”…and all that”.
It’s not about becoming oblivious…but embracing difference, understanding difference, and cultivating a stronger society from that difference.
…..oh….AND KNOWING THE DIFFERENCE. LOL!
Great Vid J!
IT’S CULTURE CRAZY,
NOVA
Jay,
Some of the stuff you said made me think of a book I just finished reading called “The Trouble with Diversity: How We Learned to Love Identity and Ignore Inequality” by Walter Benn Micheals. The book really challenges the way most progressive people (including myself) think about race today, and argues that most of our current discourse serves to both reinforce racial essentialism and ignore class inequality. If you have time to pick it up, I’d love to hear your thoughts. Based on the stuff you usually talk about, I think you’d like it.
-Ben
Hey, cheezncrakrs, I think you hit the nail on the head there. It’s the “simplistic and essentializing idea of blackness” implicit in his statement that is so offensive. And, yeah, he probably didn’t mean it that way (consciously or unconsciously). And, yeah, he probably just meant he forgot that there was anything “different” or “special” or whatever about Obama, and he could have just as easily said, “I forgot he was the first Pisces president” or “I forgot he was the first president to have an identical twin” or whatever, I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt on that.
But sometimes statements are like pieces of art, and a lot of people find meaning in them that maybe the artist didn’t intend, but we still (ok, some people) accept that as a valid interpretation of that piece of art. And I think there’s value to the analysis of a statement just as there is to the analysis of art, especially if it reveals something about ideas or beliefs or fears or hopes in our culture that normally stay implicit and don’t get aired out. Cuz the more implicit something stays, the more it tends to have power over people. It’s only when we examine an idea head on that it can dissipate on its own (as all things naturally tend to do), and release its grip over people’s minds. The only trick is to not fall victim to the trap of trying to analyze Chris Matthews (a topic you’ve talked about enough, and much better than I could, Mr. Smooth).
I’m not sure if “rationally racial” is the right term, but I get what you’re saying and I like it; let’s embrace our different cultures and heritages and ethnicities and the fact that we are all just a little bit different. Erasing a part of a culture never seemed to work too great before; it probably won’t start to now, either.
Awesome.
I agree with your points. But statements like “Black describes a particular culture in history” just screw with me–because black describes many cultures, at many different points in history, not a particular one. And the idea that black is one thing seems to keep cropping up, like brown is one thing or white is one thing. I’m white, whatever that means. It means a different thing to me than it does to my white counterpart in Ireland. Just like black means a very different thing to my colleague Ann who was born and raised in Chicago than it does to my colleague Patricia, who hails from South Africa.
But really my point is that white, or black, or brown, or whatever, don’t (or shouldn’t) mean a damn thing. In that way, they should be the same as purple. They should not be used to discuss cultures.
Colors do NOT equal cultures. They equal how much melanin is in your skin. It seems to me that once we realize that, once we can separate color from culture, maybe then we can move forward.
Am I crazy? Does that make me a racist?
How do we all start
Chris Matthews’ comments just show how much he is soaking in his white privilege. That he has to strip someone of their racial, ethnic, and/or cultural identity in order to identify with them is really telling (and depressing).
Dude, brilliantly put. “I dont care if youre black, or purple, or green…” LOL. Man.
Keep it up bro. Youre a genius.
I watched your vid after thinking long and hard the past couple weeks about the idea of blackness after watching some amazing accomplishments by Canadian athletes of African descent in the Vancouver Olympics. I saw an African Canadian woman and man take home medals in bobsled events, and Jarome Iginla share the gold medal in men’s hockey after scoring 6 goals and setting up the overtime winner.
I’m as white as they come (blended ethnicity of Polish, Ukrainian, Scottish, German, Austrian, Romanian, Irish- you get the picture), but I’ve often wondered why “blackness” seems so narrowly defined so so frequently- like, if you don’t fit one of three “acceptable” forms of blackness, then your blackness somehow doesn’t count (or is likely to be dismissed by some as “too white”).
In the spirit of that hilarious book about things white people love, I thought how brilliant it was to see beautiful black brothers and sisters dominating events most people would never assume black people knew about (BTW, major shout out to American Shani Davis for his continued dominance of long track speedskating!) and how unfortunate it was that these amazing people would likely be completely ignored as exemplars of blackness in the way that music icons are held up on Muchmusic (Canada’s MTV) during Black History Month- Flava Flav is more likely to be seen as essentially black than these other people, and I feel diminished by that!
My best friend, Gary (a Trinidadian by birth, Canadian by choice) taught me a ton about blackness- that it doesn’t need to become as if it weren’t there for progess and equality to exist, that his blackness isn’t defined by popular media portrayals or stereotypes or journalistic coverage- it’s defined by him and what he loves. I love that he digs Bryan Adams more than most of the rap out there, is gaga for fried chicken, plays hockey better than any other sport, speaks French and is equally at home at a family reunion BBQ or a black tie event.
I respect that Obama loves his blackness in the same way Gary does- it’s an essential part of the expression of self, and because he values it so highly, I think a lot of people are beginning to get beyond the cliche “black is beautiful” statement and really esteem the unique blackness in the people around them, and, in so doing, begin to appreciate the greater diaspora of blackness and its invaluable worth to our society.
In no way have we reached the promised land, but I think the fact that people can dialogue across races about blackness meaningfully in the greater context of culture and politics is a step towards the type of integration MLKII hoped we would realize together when segregation was outlawed.
Thanks for being a leader in the intelligent and truly impactful dialogue around these ideas and issues Jay- appreciate your perspective. Enjoying the new blog!
This is kind of silly, but I just wanted to say that I love that you read Racialicious! They’ve really created such a great space there.
The idea that “not being racist”=”being colorblind” is not only stupid, it’s dangerous. It sets things up so that white people can turn the label of “racist” onto people of color because “well they’re the ones who keep bringing it up” or keep “playing the race card.” And all the while real racism is ignored or dismissed. Ignoring racism, is like ignoring cancer. Not only does it not go away, it gets progressively worse, it spreads and mutates and it doesn’t stop ’till it kills you. I know that talking about race (REALLY talking) is hard for white people, it’s awkward, uncomfortable and really hard for some of us to do without getting all angry and defensive. Which is probably why the “colorblind” approach to diversity is so popular; it lets white people feel like decent, good, non-racist people, while doing nothing to dismantle (heck you could even say it was strengthening) our white privilege. Time we start unpacking that knapsack ya’ll!
“I know that talking about race (REALLY talking) is hard for white people”
WHOA. So that’s NOT a racist statement? WTF?
Teri: No, I don’t believe that it’s a racist statement at all. A simplified one maybe. It should probably say something more like “I know that talking about race (REALLY talking) is hard for (most) white (U.S.) people (because privilege is hard to confront in almost any circumstance let alone one as emotionally charged as discussing race.)
As a white person, I know that there have absolutely been times where I have failed (miserably) at having honest, intelligent, non-defensive discussions about race where I didn’t stick my foot in my mouth or sound like a jerk. And that there were times where I purposefully avoided getting involved in discussions about race because I just didn’t want to deal, or because I was afraid of the aforementioned foot-mouth thing. And I know I’m not the only one. It’s hard because if you acknowledge that you’re privileged over someone else, and that that privilege was not earned but was received in an unjust manor, to right those wrongs we would have to start balancing things out. Which would mean having to give up some of that privilege. And while plenty of white people would be willing to acknowledge that there are those who suffer disadvantages because of their race, those same white people often aren’t as ready to give up the benefits that such a system provides for them. So yeah, talking about race can be hard for white people, I mean, it deals with a lot of heavy heavy stuff (though this is not to say that I think we should just let white people off the hook. I think we do need to keep in mind that being able to avoid discussions of race if we choose, or choosing to be “colorblind”, that that is all a part of white privilege and that there are plenty of people who don’t have the luxury of “not seeing race” because race affects them everyday.) I know this is getting long, and that it might seem a little silly to respond to a one sentence rebuttal with this behemoth, but I just wanted to try and clarify where I was coming from and what I meant.
All I am saying is that any discussion that includes phrases where ANY color or type or whatever get lumped into one stereotypical blob is not getting any of us anywhere. Your statement wasn’t just simplified, it was racist.
I mean that in the same way I meant my first comment, where I sorta called out Jay (whom I love) for saying this: “But statements like “Black describes a particular culture in history”
because black describes many cultures, at many different points in history, not a particular one. And the idea that black is one thing seems to keep cropping up, like brown is one thing or white is one thing.”
If we can find a way to move past colors without trying be colorblind, to move toward actual equality regardless of color, we may make some progress. But as long as the discussion is polarized by colors and not by rights, we ain’t goin’ nowhere.
No, no, I get that you’re not trying to attack me, just call me out, and I appreciate that.
I don’t want to speak for Jay, but the feeling at least that I got from the “Black describes a particular culture in history” thing and how I originally heard it was not that black represents one particular and all encompassing monolithic culture (like some stereotyped cliched version of urban black culture you’d see in the media or on TV), but that black, within a U.S. context, has a rich a varied history. And that to compare black with green or purple or blue (which are made up and have no historical legacy to even speak of), works to diminish the validity of that history. It diminishes both the great accomplishments that black people have achieved in this country and it diminishes the oppression they had to fight against to reach those achievements.
And so, when I talk about white people, I’m talking about it in a similar sense. No, white people in the U.S. are not all the “same” but we do share a common white history and legacy. And sadly as rich and as varied as it may be, underneath all the great accomplishments and historical moments we learn about in school, a big part of our history involves trying to diminish and sometimes eradicate the histories of people of color (and even more bluntly, to diminish and eradicate the actual people themselves.) And it doesn’t matter if your family came over here with the pilgrims or if you grew up with immigrant parents in Queens. It doesn’t matter if your ancestors never owned slaves. If you’re here, and you’re white or have assimilated into whiteness (like how Irish/German/Italian immigrants did), then you benefit from that legacy.
So when I say that “it’s hard for white people to talk about race”, I’m saying that, for some white people, it’s very difficult to have honest discussions about race, BECAUSE they’re white, not for some other reason, or excuse, or because that one individual has some individual personality defect, or because that one individual “just doesn’t want to talk about ANYTHING honestly”, or whatever other reason might be given. Our reluctance to talking about race is most often tied to our desire to distance ourselves from that white legacy.
Have you ever read the blog “stuff white people do”? (not the ironic tongue-in-cheek “stuff white people like” that got a book deal, this is something else) I don’t know if posting links is allowed in comments here, but you can search for them on blogspot. It’s a blog (by a white dude) trying to explore what he calls “common white tendencies” and trying to deconstruct and talk about invisible white privilege. It might give you a better idea of some of the things I’m trying to articulate here.
Dear Sister Ray,
Oh my. I do understand what you are trying to articulate, I am just trying to say that you are not articulating it in a way that moves anyone past color talk.
I agree with you that if anyone has, as you put it, “assimilated into whiteness” (which is really a discussion about PRIVILEGE and, again, NOT SKIN COLOR) they can be blinded by the invisibility of their privilege. I also understand that historically and even today much of the price for that privelege gets paid for by groups with brown skin or black skin (or same sex partners). But at this this point in our history, that sort of invisible privilege we need to talk about also includes lots of colors. There are many black, brown yellow and gay folks benefiting from invisible privilege. So to continue to talk about these issues via color terms is counterproductive to forward progress.
My reluctance to talk about race is in NO WAY tied to my desire to distance myself from any white legacy.
It is tied to the fact that if we don’t get past the polarizing “color talk” and start to focus on ALL people getting fair privilege/rights (including black, white brown, yellow, gay, straight, etc) we will just keep playing the same broken record. This is my fear.
Done with commenting. Thanks for sharing your views.
Teri: I think the point you’re making that intersectionality is an excellent one and I wholeheartedly agree. White privilege doesn’t stand alone, and I in no way believe that white privilege is in anyway better or worse than any other form of privilege, and we need to work towards rooting out all of them. That said, I don’t think that means we can never discuss just one form of privilege on it’s own terms. Because while they do intersect and can share many similarities and they do operate under the same power structure, each has it’s own unique history and set of experiences. And conflating one kind of privilege (or lack there of) with another can be misguided, verging on the insulting. Like when The Advocate said that “gay is the new black”. But I understand that you’re done with the conversation which is cool, so I’ll wrap up and maybe I’ll see you round here some other time
Post racial vs rationally racial – Yes!
Jay, I’ve been saying this for so many years. I don’t believe that being color-blind is any more fair than being culturally blind, sexually blind, etc.. I think that we should strive to be color/racially aware instead of blind. People need to be aware that your race, color, sex, language, income, country of origin, etc. all have fundamental impacts on your personality. To ignore the factors that “can” make us who we are today is just plain ignorant. It denies us the opportunity to identify our own prejudices as well. Don’t enslave me to a stereotype of being black, but never forget that my experience is fundamentally black too.
Thanks for being so enlightening, Jay.
Personally, my opinion Nil Doctrine – Raw Footage “I Forgot He Was Black” is in fact a incredibly well written narrative. Undeniably meriting bringing up and as well as deserving of mentioning http://nildoctrine.com/nil/raw-footage-i-forgot-he-was-black as a result. Regards, Bobette Caryl
I am a regular viewer of his show hardball and Matthews is a guy who outwardly said he wanted the President to succeed and was rooting for him. But ultimately, you are judged by results. He has stated that the President’s family is a model for American society and is examples of hard work and determination. What that said, let’s not forget the President is black. People like the Tea Party Movement are well aware of that and it scares them. And Matthews has always hinted that fact that there is something else out there that are fanning the flames of discontent.
I think Matthews was simply stating that here is a guy who based on his performance that night, you judge him based on his character. Other then that the rest is much ado about nothing.
mc4
COMPLETELY AGREE with this! Even further then that, I believe with need to accept some of our short comings as ethnic/cultural groups and move forward. I feel that ethnicity in North America has been made to be a disease instead of an integral part of someone’s mix. Hence, even though we are proud at times, we get offended by small things that at times should simply be laughed at. Hopefully one day we’ll get there.
Thanks Jay for the great vlogs/rant love it!
Peace – MECH
Yes, exactly:
“I don’t want to speak for Jay, but the feeling at least that I got from the “Black describes a particular culture in history” thing and how I originally heard it was not that black represents one particular and all encompassing monolithic culture (like some stereotyped cliched version of urban black culture you’d see in the media or on TV), but that black, within a U.S. context, has a rich a varied history. And that to compare black with green or purple or blue (which are made up and have no historical legacy to even speak of), works to diminish the validity of that history.”
Coming from the Netherlands and not really understanding the American race sensitivities all this leaves me with a question. Can you explain to me why you consider yourself black although you obviously are not physically? What does “people don’t realize I’m black but I am” actually mean?
This all reminds me of the Ali G joke: “izz it because I izz black?”